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Against the Rules with Michael Lewis: The Trial of Sam Bankman-Fried

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Pushkin Industries

From Michael Lewis and Against The Rules comes a special series – Judging Sam: The Trial of Sam Bankman-Fried. Judging Sam will follow the daily courtroom drama as the former FTX CEO is tried for financial crimes, with expert commentary from author and Against the Rules host Michael Lewis, reporter and Against the Rules producer Lidia Jean Kott, finance journalist and What’s Your Problem host Jacob Goldstein, as well as legal experts and journalists who cover cryptocurrency and the law. iHeartMedia is the exclusive podcast partner of Pushkin Industries.

#75

Judging Sam: The Sentencing

Sam Bankman-Fried was sentenced to 25 years in prison after being convicted of fraud and conspiracy. Michael Lewis and Lidia Jean Kott were there in court. They talk about what happened with Judging Sam’s legal expert, Rebecca Mermelstein, a former federal prosecutor and partner at O'Melveny and Myers. See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

29 Mar 2024

41 MINS

41:36

29 Mar 2024

#74

Judging Sam: Judging the FTX Bankruptcy

While Sam Bankman-Fried has been on trial, the cryptocurrency exchange he founded, FTX, has been going through bankruptcy proceedings. Jonathan Lipson, a professor at Temple Law School, tells Michael Lewis that he believes the proceedings have highlighted problems with the US bankruptcy system. Jonathan Lipson’s research paper “FTX’d: Conflicting Public and Private Interests in Chapter 11” is forthcoming in the Stanford Law Review. You can read a draft [here] (https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4760736) . You can listen to our previous interview about the FTX bankruptcy with Jonathan’s co-author, David Skeel, [here] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules/on-background-a-history-of-bankruptcy-in-the-us) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

27 Mar 2024

43 MINS

43:17

27 Mar 2024

#73

Judging Sam is Coming Back

This fall we covered the trial of Sam Bankman-Fried, the founder of the failed cryptocurrency exchange FTX. He was found guilty of fraud and conspiracy and could face decades in prison. Now, we are covering his sentencing. Check here for those episodes starting the week of March 25th. See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

22 Mar 2024

00 MINS

00:42

22 Mar 2024

#72

Michael Lewis on Freakonomics Radio

Enjoy this episode of [Freakonomics Radio] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/freakonomics-radio/id354668519) , where Michael Lewis sat down with Stephen Dubner to discuss his book “Going Infinite: The Rise and Fall of a New Tycoon.” Description from the original episode:Lewis got incredible access to Sam Bankman-Fried, the billionaire behind the spectacular FTX fraud. His book is a bestseller, but some critics say he went too easy on S.B.F. Lewis tells us why the critics are wrong — and what it’s like to watch your book get turned into a courtroom drama. See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

19 Feb 2024

1 HR 00 MINS

1:00:59

19 Feb 2024

#71

The Rise and Fall of Crypto Billionaire Sam Bankman-Fried from Talk Easy

Enjoy this episode from another Pushkin Industries podcast, [Talk Easy with Sam Fragoso] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/talk-easy-with-sam-fragoso/id1100417601) . Upon taking a walk with crypto billionaire Sam Bankman-Fried, writer Michael Lewis had a sense that there might be a story here. In the intervening two years, that story has taken a series of twists and turns, resulting in Lewis’ new book [Going Infinite: The Rise and Fall of a New Tycoon] (https://wwnorton.com/books/9781324074335) . At the top, we walk through Bankman-Fried’s Manhattan trial, the subject at the center of this winding story, and why Lewis was first interested in observing him. Then, he unpacks Bankman-Fried’s belief in effective altruism, his probabilistic approach to trading, and how his Stanford law professor parents shaped his thinking. On the back-half, we discuss the ten-day period of FTX’s collapse, the scene in the Bahamas as Bankman-Fried filed for bankruptcy, and why Lewis felt a kinship with Sam’s parents in that moment. To close, Michael reflects on his own journalistic tendencies and how he managed to write this book in the aftermath of great personal tragedy. For thoughts, reflections, and guest suggestions, drop Sam a line at [sf@talkeasypod.com] (mailto:sf@talkeasypod.com) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

12 Dec 2023

1 HR 04 MINS

1:04:48

12 Dec 2023

#70

Judging Sam: Millennial Frauds

Lidia Jean Kott talks to journalist Elizabeth Lopatto about what it was like to cover the trial, the similarities it shared with Elizabeth Holmes’ trial, and what this all says about millennials, fraud, and the future of the tech industry. This conversation was recorded on November 13. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

17 Nov 2023

30 MINS

30:48

17 Nov 2023

#69

Judging Sam: The Aftermath

It's all over. Sam Bankman-Fried was found guilty on all seven counts. But what now? Michael Lewis, Lidia Jean Kott, and Judging Sam’s legal expert, O’Melveny defense attorney Rebecca Mermelstein, reflect on the outcome and look ahead to sentencing, SBF's other legal troubles, and the fate of the cooperating witnesses. This conversation was recorded on November 7. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

09 Nov 2023

34 MINS

34:22

09 Nov 2023

#68

Judging Sam: Guilty on all counts

The jury, after about 4 and a half hours of deliberation, has delivered its verdict – guilty on all seven counts. Lidia Jean Kott was in the courtroom when it happened. Her conversation with financial reporter Jacob Goldstein was recorded on November 2. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

03 Nov 2023

08 MINS

08:42

03 Nov 2023

#67

Judging Sam: The jury's job

CORRECTION: In an earlier version of this episode, our guest incorrectly stated that in the case of a hung jury, a defendant cannot be retried without risking double jeopardy. This is incorrect. If the jury hangs, then the defendant can be retried. We have edited the episode to remove this and apologize for the error. It’s nearly time for the jury to begin their deliberations. They’ll file into a backroom at the courthouse, and SBF’s fate will be in their hands. But what goes on behind those doors? How will the jury get to its verdict? Trial consultant Ellen Leggett returns to the show to talk through the process with Lidia Jean Kott. This conversation was recorded on October 27 and updated on November 1. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

02 Nov 2023

20 MINS

20:32

02 Nov 2023

#66

Judging Sam: The Hail Mary That Wasn’t

We're finally in the home stretch. Today the prosecution finished their cross examination of Sam Bankman-Fried, the defense followed up with a redirect, and then both sides rested. It’s Michael’s last day at court, but Lidia Jean will attend until the bitter end. They sit down to talk through the trial day’s events. This conversation was recorded on October 31. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

01 Nov 2023

24 MINS

24:22

01 Nov 2023

#65

Judging Sam: Sam Bankman-Fried Faces Cross-Examination

Sam Bankman-Fried finishes direct and faces withering cross-examination by the government’s chief prosecutor, Danielle Sassoon. Michael Lewis and Lidia Jean Kott share notes during lunch, then Lidia Jean sits down with Pushkin financial reporter and host Jacob Goldstein to talk through the day’s events. This conversation was recorded on October 30. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

31 Oct 2023

13 MINS

13:44

31 Oct 2023

#64

Judging Sam: Sam Bankman-Fried Takes The Stand

The day is finally upon us: Sam Bankman-Fried takes the stand. Michael Lewis and Lidia Jean meet up after a long day in court and discuss everything that went down. This conversation was recorded on October 27. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

28 Oct 2023

21 MINS

21:09

28 Oct 2023

#63

Judging Sam: Michael Lewis comes to court

Michael Lewis finishes his book tour and joins Lidia Jean Kott in court. His timing, as usual, is impeccable. The government rests its case. And then, everyone thinks Sam Bankman-Fried will take the stand. Instead, in a surprise twist, Judge Kaplan sends the jury home. LJ and Michael meet up on the courthouse steps to talk through the day’s events. This conversation was recorded on October 26. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

27 Oct 2023

17 MINS

17:54

27 Oct 2023

#62

Judging Sam: After The Prosecution Rests

After a few days off, the trial resumes tomorrow, October 26. The prosecution has said they will likely be ready to rest their case by midday. Michael Lewis, Lidia Jean Kott and Rebecca Mermelstein, a partner at the law firm O’Melveny & Myers, sit down to analyze the prosecution’s case and talk about what might happen next, including the possibility of Sam Bankman-Fried taking the stand. This conversation was recorded on October 23. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

25 Oct 2023

28 MINS

28:39

25 Oct 2023

#61

Judging Sam: An FTX Victim Speaks Out

Voices of the victims of Sam Bankman-Fried’s alleged crimes have been few and far between during the prosecution’s presentation of its case. On today’s show, Lidia Jean Kott sits down with Jake Thacker, a tech worker from Portland, Oregon who borrowed money to bet big on FTX, only to be left holding the bag. He says he’s now bankrupt and unsure whether he’ll be able to keep his home. This conversation was recorded on October 23. Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting [atrpodcast.com] (https://www.pushkin.fm/podcasts/against-the-rules) To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in [Apple Podcasts] (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/against-the-rules-with-michael-lewis-the-trial/id1455379351) or at [Pushkin.fm/plus] (https://www.pushkin.fm/join-pushkin) . See [omnystudio.com/listener] (https://omnystudio.com/listener) for privacy information. ... Read more

24 Oct 2023

20 MINS

20:33

24 Oct 2023

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#75