The “Hard Fork” team is taking a break this week as we prepare for our upcoming live show in San Francisco.
While we’re away, we’re bringing you a recent episode of “Interesting Times” with Ross Douthat that we really enjoyed.
In this episode, Ross talks with Andrew Miller, writer of the transportation policy newsletter “Changing Lanes” and co-author of the book “The End of Driving.”
Together, they explore the potential benefits of driverless cars — from fewer car crashes to reclaimed time and attention — as well as what could be lost if we don’t have to be in the driver’s seat anymore.
Guest:
<ul>
 <li>Andrew Miller,  writer of the newsletter <a href="https://www.changinglanesnewsletter.com/about" rel="noopener noreferrer">“Changing Lanes.”</a></li>
</ul>
Additional Reading:
<ul>
 <li>A full transcript and video of this episode can be found <a href="https://www.nytimes.com/2026/04/30/opinion/waymo-self-driving-cars-andrew-miller.html" rel="noopener noreferrer">here</a>. </li>
</ul>

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