<img fetchpriority="high" decoding="async" class="alignright wp-image-25347" src="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/251013_HoffmanPodcast_Drew-Horning_Portrait-731x1024.png" alt="Drew Horning Hoffman Podcast S11e9" width="300" height="420" srcset="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/251013_HoffmanPodcast_Drew-Horning_Portrait-731x1024.png 731w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/251013_HoffmanPodcast_Drew-Horning_Portrait-214x300.png 214w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/251013_HoffmanPodcast_Drew-Horning_Portrait-768x1075.png 768w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/251013_HoffmanPodcast_Drew-Horning_Portrait-1097x1536.png 1097w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/251013_HoffmanPodcast_Drew-Horning_Portrait-1463x2048.png 1463w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/251013_HoffmanPodcast_Drew-Horning_Portrait-350x490.png 350w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/251013_HoffmanPodcast_Drew-Horning_Portrait.png 1502w" sizes="(max-width: 300px) 100vw, 300px" />
&#8220;We&#8217;re 100% Divine and 100% human. It&#8217;s in that shared common connection between the two of those that real magic happens.&#8221; Drew Horning
Hoffman teacher, coach, and podcast host, Drew Horning, sits in the guest chair today to share about his time in <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/the-process/">the Process</a> and so much more.
Drew originally came to <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/the-process/">the Process</a> in 2013 for support with marital relationship issues, having heard about Hoffman from someone in his men&#8217;s group. Looking back, Drew says Hoffman was one of the most profound experiences of his life. Just a year later, in 2014, he began his training to become a Hoffman teacher.
Drew shares two vulnerable moments from his week. He shares about the profound student-teacher relationship he experienced with his teacher, Raz. More like a mentor or coach than a teacher, Drew knew Raz had his back all the way through the Process.
<figure id="attachment_25387" aria-describedby="caption-attachment-25387" style="width: 283px" class="wp-caption alignleft"><img decoding="async" class="wp-image-25387" src="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/Drew-and-Sadie-Hoffman-Podcast_Cropped-1003x1024.png" alt="Drew Horning Sadie Hannah Hoffman Podcast" width="283" height="289" srcset="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/Drew-and-Sadie-Hoffman-Podcast_Cropped-1003x1024.png 1003w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/Drew-and-Sadie-Hoffman-Podcast_Cropped-294x300.png 294w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/Drew-and-Sadie-Hoffman-Podcast_Cropped-768x784.png 768w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/Drew-and-Sadie-Hoffman-Podcast_Cropped-1504x1536.png 1504w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/Drew-and-Sadie-Hoffman-Podcast_Cropped-350x357.png 350w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/10/Drew-and-Sadie-Hoffman-Podcast_Cropped.png 1899w" sizes="(max-width: 283px) 100vw, 283px" /><figcaption id="caption-attachment-25387" class="wp-caption-text">Drew and Sadie</figcaption></figure>
The deeper story here, though, is how the Process opens the way for us to experience the full range of being human. Drew sees the Process as an exploration into what it means to be human, both the light and the dark within us. In one experiential exercise, Drew says he &#8220;touched this part, this base part of being human,&#8221; and it &#8220;caused him to recoil.&#8221; In the very next moment, he and his group were led directly into a compassion exercise. And what transpired was the transformation so key to the Hoffman Process. Moments after he touched into this darkness, he found himself held in love. Love is always embracing us, even in our darkest moments as human beings.
Here we witness Drew’s vulnerability and wisdom as a human being and a Hoffman teacher. He holds the human heart with gentleness, dignity, and respect. We hope you enjoy this conversation.
<h3>More about Drew Horning:</h3>
A former licensed private practice psychotherapist, Drew has a Master&#8217;s degree in clinical work from the University of Michigan. He is trained in <a href="https://www.emdr.com/what-is-emdr/">EMDR</a>, Mediation and Dispute Resolution, <a href="https://www.campbellteenfamilytherapy.com/how-we-treat/gottman-method-couples-therapy/?gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=23086479994&gbraid=0AAAAADBmJvG18oP-NzDS8IvHMtPwJ48Jq&gclid=CjwKCAjwup3HBhAAEiwA7euZuk_guM6kbBqJZGJ7DXozeTS8Kx-a_yhTBrc2RSFXNrY2AOy0wWlQLhoCC0oQAvD_BwE">Gottman Couples Counseling</a>, and <a href="https://brenebrown.com/thedaringway/">Brené Brown’s Daring Way</a>. He hosts <a href="https://www.elephanttalk.org/">his own podcast on relationships.</a> Drew has also coached high school basketball. Drew published his book, <a href="https://www.amazon.com/Grappling-White-Journey-Fragile-Agile/dp/1544519605">Grappling: White Men’s Journey from Fragile to Agile</a>, in May 2021. He is currently a manager of <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/faculty-bios/">the faculty</a> as <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/drew-horning/">a core faculty member of the Hoffman Institute</a>.
Drew is on the board of his extended family&#8217;s real estate business. He is committed to his own family, his two adult children, and his wife of nearly 25 years.
Drew is committed to his own personal growth work and supporting others on their own journey towards wellness. Healing requires incredible courage and a commitment to kindness. The alchemy of these is what Hoffman and Drew are all about!
Follow <a href="https://www.instagram.com/ajhorning/">Drew on Instagram</a>.

<h5><a href="https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/s11e9-drew-horning-what-it-means-to-be-human/id1516681509?i=1000732157626">Listen on Apple Podcasts</a></h5>
<h3>As mentioned in this episode:</h3>
Raz Ingrasci, Founder of the Hoffman Institute and Hoffman teacher, was Drew&#8217;s teacher.
•   Listen to <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/podcast/episode-21-raz-ingrasci/">Raz on the Hoffman Podcast: Husband, Father, Son</a>
<a href="https://www.besselvanderkolk.com/resources/the-body-keeps-the-score">The Body Keeps the Score</a>, by <a href="https://www.besselvanderkolk.com/about/biography">Bessel van der Kolk MD</a>
<a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/rebirth/">White Sulphur Springs</a>
•   &#8220;All things change when we do.&#8221; This is the quote Drew mentions from the fountain at <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/rebirth/">White Sulphur Springs, our former retreat site.</a>
Dr. Dan Siegel, &#8220;feeling felt&#8221;
•   “Wonderful things happen when people feel felt, when they sense that their minds are held within another’s mind.” Dan Siegel
•   Listen to Dr. Dan Siegel on the Hoffman Podcast: <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/podcast/s8e8-dr-dan-siegel/">A Rabbit, Doe, & Fawn Become Partners in Transformation</a>
Listen to <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/podcast/s8e10-dr-jill-bolte-taylor/">Dr. Jill Bolte Taylor on the Hoffman Podcast: Your Brain From the Inside Out</a>
• <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxARXvljKBA">Dr Bolte Taylor&#8217;s 90-second rule</a>
&#8220;Ed&#8221; McClune, retired Hoffman teacher and coach:
•   Listen to Ed on <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/podcast/s3e10-ed-mcclune/">the Hoffman Podcast: A Good Hoffman Geek Out</a>
&#8220;I close my eyes so that I may see.&#8221; <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Gauguin">Paul Gauguin, French painter, sculptor, printmaker, ceramist, and writer&#8230;</a>
&#8220;This will grow inside you.&#8221; Liza Ingrasci, CEO of the Hoffman Institute Foundation. She has been with the Hoffman Institute since 1990.
Drew speaks of &#8220;the surprising power of Self-compassion,&#8221; also called <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Zu6DVJgbME&t=659">Inner-Compassion by Dan Siegel</a>.
<a href="https://jungiancenter.org/jung-on-paradox/">Carl Jung and the power of Paradox</a>
“&#8230;only paradox “… comes anywhere near to comprehending the fullness of life.” <a href="https://jungiancenter.org/jung-on-paradox/">Read more&#8230;</a>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Original_sin">Original Sin</a>
•   Drew shares that for him, <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/the-process/" target="_blank" rel="noopener">the</a><a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/the-process/"> Hoffman Process</a> is the story of original love.
<h3>Hoffman Terminology and Tools:</h3>
Vindictiveness &#8211; &#8220;&#8230;part of what it means to be human.&#8221;
•   Definition: a strong desire for revenge or to punish someone who has wronged you. It is characterized by holding grudges, a vengeful spirit, and the tendency to seek retaliation. Synonyms include vengefulness, spitefulness, and rancor. 
The Cycle of Transformation:
The four steps in the cycle are Awareness, Expression, Compassion, and New Ways of Being. All four make up the <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/tools/">Cycle of Transformation</a>.
<img decoding="async" class="wp-image-10536 alignleft" src="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Cycle-of-Transformation-New-791x1024.jpg" alt="Cycle of Transformation" width="201" height="260" srcset="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Cycle-of-Transformation-New-791x1024.jpg 791w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Cycle-of-Transformation-New-350x453.jpg 350w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Cycle-of-Transformation-New-232x300.jpg 232w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Cycle-of-Transformation-New-768x994.jpg 768w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Cycle-of-Transformation-New-1187x1536.jpg 1187w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Cycle-of-Transformation-New-1000x1294.jpg 1000w, https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Cycle-of-Transformation-New.jpg 1275w" sizes="(max-width: 201px) 100vw, 201px" />
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&#8220;You can act yourself into a new way of thinking, but you cannot think yourself into a new way of acting.&#8221; Quote from the Hoffman Process
<a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/left-road-right-road-visualization/">Left Road, Right Road</a>
•   <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/Left-Road-Right-Road-0224.pdf">Hoffman tool</a>
•   Spirit and Human, Spirit Embodied
Process Integration Weekend:
Two days following the Process, graduates take time alone to integrate the deep work they&#8217;ve just accomplished. <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/podcast/s10e7-post-process-panel/">Listen to our panel speak about the Integration weekend on the Hoffman Podcast</a>.
The Ceremony of Integration:
A guided, experiential ritual during the Process to bring everything together and integrate the Quadrinity.
Hoffman Pre-calls:
Each student attending the Hoffman Process has a pre-call with their Hoffman teacher before coming to the retreat site.
<a href="https://www.webmd.com/mental-health/what-is-transference">What is Transference?</a>
The Quadrinity:
“I coined the word Quadrinity to represent the four aspects of a human being: the Emotional, Intellectual, Physical, and Spiritual. The unique capacities and functions of each aspect can be considered separately, but it is the balance of all aspects working together harmoniously that fulfills us as human beings.” – <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/bob-hoffman/">Bob Hoffman, Founder of the Hoffman Process</a>
<a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/Practices-FeelingsSensations.pdf">Hoffman Feelings and Body Sensations List (PDF)</a>
<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essence">Essence</a>
Be-Do-Have vs. Do-Have-Be:
The life we long for comes from Be-Do-Have; the life we are taught we should strive for comes from Do-Have-Be.
&#8220;I am love, loving, and lovable.&#8221; <a href="https://www.hoffmaninstitute.org/the-process/">The Hoffman Process</a>

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